New films on Prince Madoc

The Madoc legend lives in Southern Indiana:  Documentary makers hope to bring pictures to author’s workA Celtic prince, refusing to fight his brothers for the throne after their father’s death, leaves 12th century Britain with 10 boats of Welsh men and women.

They sail across the Atlantic Ocean and come ashore on the coast of the New World at what is now Mobile, Ala., centuries before Christopher Columbus’ voyage.

The settlers followed the rivers north, founding settlements along the way, but repeatedly fleeing hostile locals. They eventually settled in Clark County, where a bloody, final battle virtually eliminated the race. Traces of their civilization and possibly some descendants survive today, but their connections to the past are lost.

This is a common variation of the legend of Prince Madoc, his fellow settlers and their descendants. The story has persisted for centuries, particularly in Britain and in areas such as Indiana where these pre-Columbian European settlers are said to have lived and built forts. New life is being breathed into the legend by filmmakers.The primary film "breathing life" into the legend:On a morning last summer, documentary filmmakers Jon Haskell and Paul Barlow of Seanachie Interactive of Westfield braved nettles, ticks and drenching humidity to venture into Charlestown State Park with local author Dana Olson to film a site said to be a former Welsh, pre-Columbian era fort. This area unveils Devil’s Backbone, which sits on a high ridge on a peninsula formed by Fourteen Mile Creek and the Ohio River.

Olson, of Jeffersonville, is the author of “The Legend of Prince Madoc and the White Indians,” originally published in 1987. Olson said he has sold approximately 10,000 copies of the book.

It was a trip several years ago to the Falls of the Ohio State Park and reading Olson’s book—found at the gift shop—which inspired Haskell to make the film. He has since traveled with Olson and archeologist Sundea Murphy to sites said to support the legend as fact.But the critics say the legend is a myth:Murphy is assisting Olson in preparing the third edition of “The Legend of Prince Madoc and the White Indians,” which will include footnotes the previous two editions lacked. It is hoped this will calm some of the criticism directed at him.

Local historian and Indiana University Southeast history professor Carl Kramer has been among Olson’s critics. Kramer dismissed many of the claims of the legend on a point-by-point basis during a phone interview. For example, a key part of the story includes early accounts of Indians describing a tribe as yellow-haired and blue-eyed. Kramer points out these are recessive traits unlikely to be dominant among a group of people.

He is also concerned about a subtle racism to the claims. A 19th century description and assessment of a stone fort suggests the construction must be European as the “savages” couldn’t have done it. Historians now know there were many technologically sophisticated cultures among the nations of North America.Look out...a feature film may be in the works:The legend and its local teller have also caught the attention of independent movie producer, Tom Chaudoin, president of Axel Media Group of Asheville, N.C., Chaudoin believes the story would “make a great feature film with a large budget.”

He is interested in Olson serving as at least a consultant and possibly filming a cameo in the movie. Chaudoin said he already has a few scenes written and hopes to have a complete script within a month.Comment:  I've covered the Madoc myth before. See Welsh Society Wants Madoc Plaque for the latest posting.

I can just imagine how stereotypical Chaudoin's film will be. The dwindling band of noble, civilized Europeans against hordes of murderous, savage Indians. With Princess Moon Flower trying to save Prince Madoc, the man she loves, from her bloodthirsty brethren. Spare me.

For more on the subject, see The Best Indian Movies.

Welsh Society wants Madoc plaque

Storm over missing Madoc plaqueA WELSH society from Alabama in the USA are up in arms over a missing plaque dedicated to Welsh Prince Madoc.

The Alabama Welsh Society are currently petitioning the Mayor of the city of Mobile, Sam Jones, to resite the monument after it was removed by the Parks Department 20 years ago.

Prince Madoc is believed to have landed at Mobile Bay in 1170--over 300 years before Christopher Columbus--after setting off from Rhos on Sea with his brother Rhirid following the death of their father Owain Gwynedd.

Although Madoc is the subject of much historical speculation, his legacy is still strong in America where him and his group are believed to have settled amongst a Native American tribe.Comment:  For more on the story, see Madoc and the Welsh Indians and Mandans = Welshmen?

Madoc and the Welsh Indians

Will DNA turn Madoc myth into reality?

The search is on for evidence supporting the idea a Welsh prince settled in the Americas around 1170There are different stories told in Wales about Madoc (Madog in Welsh) but most agree Madoc was the son of Owain King of Gwynedd (North Wales). Some say his mother was Brenda, a Viking princess from Ireland who sent him to be raised by Pendaran, an old Druid.

When Owain died in 1169, fighting broke out among his 24 children for the right to rule. According to the legend, Madoc decided not to pursue a claim to the throne, so with his brother, Riryd (Regyd), he left the North Wales Coast (now Rhos-on-Sea) in two ships. They sailed west to what is now Mobile Bay, Ala., and liked it so much one ship returned to Wales for more adventurers. They sailed up rivers, settling in what is Georgia, Kentucky, and Tennessee, building stone forts.

After 1186, they were ambushed while sailing downriver. In a truce Madoc and his followers left, sailed to the Mississippi, up the Missouri and settled with a tribe called Mandans.The evidence:Kimberley, 63, a former engineer who spent years researching the Madoc story, says many historians dismiss it as an Elizabethan invention, created to lay prior claim on the New World by saying that Madoc discovered America 300 years before Columbus.

But Kimberley says he has found copies of references to Madoc that pre-date the reign of Elizabeth I and Columbus' trips.

Kimberley, studying for a master's degree in Celtic History at the University of Wales in the hopes of uncovering more evidence, wants to raise funds to cover the cost of DNA tests to help prove the Madoc story.

The challenge is obtaining permission to test Native American bone samples that pre-date Columbus. Kimberley has found an ally in a Shawnee "wisdom-keeper" named Ken Lonewolf.

Lonewolf, 67, from the Pittsburgh area, believes he is descended from a tribe of Welsh Indians and is working on persuading U.S. authorities to release samples for DNA testing and carbon dating.

"Our last Shawnee leader was named Chief White Madoc; this name must have been passed down for many generations," says Lonewolf.

Mandans = Welshmen?

The Straight Dope®I would love to believe the legends about the Mandan Indians, reputed to have descended from an ill-fated colony of Welshmen who arrived in ships in the 1100s. Their leader was a prince named Madoc. Are you going to burst my bubble? Or is there something to this? --Bill Morse, Whitefish Bay, Wisconsin

Welsh Indians? Dylan Thomas, Richard Burton, and Cochise? Sorry, ain't seeing it, and I have a hard time imagining anybody ever could. But some did. The Madoc-Mandan yarn is one of many far-fetched stories about European or even extraterrestrial origins for indigenous American culture, the idea evidently being that actual Native Americans were too backward to have come up with this stuff on their own. The Welsh angle is distinguished mainly by its persistence, having bubbled up like swamp gas for more than 400 years. I have no illusions about being able to stamp it out now. But it lacks any basis in fact.