January 27, 2008

AhNiYvWiYa Inc.

Here's another posting on a dubious Cherokee tribe. I first posted an article about them in Feb. 2007. Since then I've been debating with Stephen "Wind Walker" about his "father," "Chief Paul White Eagle" in the comments section.

The crux of the debate is whether the tribe is genuine and how it determines its membership. Therefore, some quotes on the subject may be illuminating:

Legal Status of AhNiYvWiYa Inc.AhNiYvWiYa is a legal corporation name registered in the State of Missouri.

AhNiYvWiYa is registered with the Internal Revenue Service of the United States of America as a 501C3 Non-profit Native American Tribe under the categories of Religion and Education.

AhNiYvWiYa Inc. Tribe of Native People is not under treaty with the Federal Government, therefore is not Federally Recognized.
MembershipThose seeking Tribal membership must provide information of their bloodlines. This requirement will be discussed through correspondence with the Tribal Office. Once this is established, each applicant is asked to attend gatherings by invitation from the Chief.

Correspondence must be maintained with the Tribal Office over a designated period of time before an applicant is given the Application for Tribal Membership. Because so many are interested in just being "Indian" by card membership and not interested in living the traditional culture of our people, the AhNiYvWiYa want to see from the applicant their sincere desire to be associated with the AhNiYvWiYa ah-ni-gu-ta-ni. Holding a card from a Tribe does not make you a Native Person. Living a true culture of Native People makes one Native.
Teaching 'the human people'

Whether they are an actual tribe is debated.Most of the AhNiYvWiYa do not look native at all. Blue eyes and fair features are not uncommon among their ranks. Talk to them and most claim only a grandparent or even a great-grandparent of any Cherokee stock.

So are they really Indian?

It's an uncomfortable question that gets to the heart of ethnicity and identity in the 21st century. In a melting pot world, who gets to decide who the "real" members of any group should be?

"We do not look at a quantum of blood," said White Eagle of his tribal requirements.
Comment:  I guess Wind Walker thought the debate was over and he was going to have the final word. Oops...not quite.

Also of interest is Chief Paul White Eagle's art. As a website assures us:Chief Paul White Eagle is a skilled painter, as you can see in his artwork shown here.

17 comments:

russell said...

Writerfella here --
Boy, oh boy! A dollar will get you a doughnut that Rob can't wait until this 'tribe' gets itself a casino! Cha-Ching! $$$$$$$$$...
All Best
Russ Bates
'writerfella'

The Local Crank said...

"Wind Walker"? "White Eagle"? Good God, can't these frauds even be bothered to come with authentic fake Cherokee names? And is it just me, or does "Chief White Eagle" look alot like Paul Sorvino? And if he's advertizing his paintings as "Indian art," he's violating federal law.

russell said...

Writerfella here --
Hey, this is Rob's chance to get himself declared a Native American! About time he used those $20 checks to good purpose...
All Best
Russ Bates
'writerfella'

Rob said...

I agree, Local Crank. The idea that every Indian is named after a bear, wolf, eagle, or hawk is a stereotype and a joke.

Let's hope "Wind Walker" returns to this blog and addresses these issues. Maybe he'll tell us what his birth name was.

Thanks also for showing us the difference between a constructive comment and a destructive one. Your comment is an example of the former, while Russ's is an example of the latter.

I guess you've decided to resume lying about my income, Russ? If you insist, let's add this to the list of hits that come up when you Google

Russell Bates liar

FYI, there are three hits at the top of the list so far. This should be the fourth.

dmarks said...

Local Crank: I wonder if there is a member of that tribe named "Ocarana of Time"

Rob: I once visited a tribe, where everyone I met had fox, bear, or bird in their surname. No eagles, though.

Russ: Yes, it's quite clear that Rob is a wannabe, and admires wannabes, and his main goal is to be declared Native. I so am looking forward for you providing us with links to some of Rob's namy posts at "Newspaper Rock" that tell us this. Has to be easy, right? So, let's see 'em.

The Local Crank said...

Local Crank: I wonder if there is a member of that tribe named "Ocarana of Time"


Or perhaps "Quantum of Solace"?

Rob said...

Which tribe is that, DMarks?

If I were a wannabe, which I'm not, I'd choose an uninspiring name like "Blue Duck," "Back Fat," or "Falls Down." Then people would say, "That guy doesn't have a phony bear, wolf, or eagle name. He must be a real Indian."

Rob said...

Russ challenges my integrity because he can't challenge my positions. Luckily he's so laughably bad at it.

I think it's safe to say he can't and won't justify his attempts at character assassination. He's a poseur who attacks me because he has no other way to bolster his fragile ego.

That's also why he talks so much about himself. If he doesn't remind himself (and us) about his achievements once or twice a week, he thinks people will forget him.

dmarks said...

Rob: Which tribe? Why, one of the spacefaring Chickasaw, of courss!

dmarks said...

...and with the name "Wolf Eaglebear".

Rob said...

I thought you said everyone you met--meaning a lot of people--had that kind of name. You were only talking about one Chickasaw Indian?

Rob said...

Here are the names of the six Crow scouts who accompanied Custer:

Half Yellow Face
White Swan
Goes Ahead
Hairy Moccasin
Curley
White Man Runs Him

I'd say these are typical Plains-style names. To me they sound odd and unpredictable. Notably, there's no bear, wolf, eagle, or hawk among them.

If an Indian wannabe ever names himself Half Yellow Face or Hairy Moccasin, you have my permission to fall over in a dead faint. It hasn't happened yet and I don't it expect to happen soon. Wannabes think being Indian is all about unleashing their inner bear, wolf, eagle, or hawk, so they name themselves accordingly.

Right, Wind Walker and White Eagle? Please let us know if I have you pegged correctly.

Anonymous said...

you ignorant people do not have a clue about anything truly Native! just stay lost in your confused babylon world of the concrete jungle that robs you of your life force and spirit!

Anonymous said...

boy you guys sure do show alot about yourselves! you have no idea about anything truly native or spiritual & have no clue to who Paul White Eagle really is and what all he has done in his 70 years of life! i dont know where you got that picture of him with a painting, but that is nowhere near his best work! you want to talk about names, yes those names you mentioned are accurate but they are also directly influenced by the white society! what about black fox, black horse, black elk, red cloud, ten bears, sitting bull, turkey feather, etc etc etc! i have known Paul & Stephen for many many years and you all know nothing factual! signed- professor wainwright archaeological & native studies!!!!

Rob said...

If you know something I don't, Professor, it isn't obvious from your comments. So go ahead...tell us all about "what's truly Native." Make sure you include at least one factual statement for us to examine. So far your testimonials have been mere puffery--as empty as hot air.

I'm sure the AhNiYvWiYa names are "accurate." The question is whether the process for choosing them was authentic. Why don't you tell us the ancient Cherokee tradition that gave "White Eagle" and "Wind Walker" their names? Then we can judge whether their names are genuine or made up to make them sound good.

Anonymous said...

i will leave you with this bit of information! what it means to be truly native is to not play indian and be some type of powwow indian following the traditions of the plains natives or being mixed up in a concoction of different tribes beliefs and calling it traditional! it means knowing and following the true and ancient ways culture language heritage etc of your own people and following it with all that you are! also, they both were given their names to them from an elder man who also happened to be a medicine man! 3 ways to recieve a name is this way or a special event happens in your life that describes who & what you are or the ancestors may give it in the form of a visionary type of dream state! now leave them alone they have done nothing to noone and want only to be left alone! good day to you sir! signed prof. wainwright

Rob said...

So Wind Walker and White Eagle got their names from an "elder man"? Who...Iron Eyes Cody? Was this person even an Indian?

You didn't include the factual statements I asked for, Professor. You could've gotten your latest answer from a New Age greeting card. I don't see any evidence that you know more about being "truly Native" than I do.

P.S. That's enough commentary on this old thread. If you have anything else to say, e-mail it to me. If it's appropriate, I'll start a new thread on Newspaper Rock.